Image problem, yes we have one...

I am bringing this discussion back tio the Footy Forums because what I want to say is purely Footy Class related… forgive me Angus.

I am the person Angus speaks of above and the originator of the comments is a well respected customer of mine. In fact he phoned me from the east coast purely to discuss this matter.

I am certainly supportive of the potential of the Footy class to bring in youngsters due to it’s attractive size and cost, so please understand that first but…

As my contact quite truthfully pointed out the first visual impression given by the AMYA Official Footy Page is that this is a mere toy class for children. That first impression will stick and from the point of view of growing the class he believes that it is not a good choice of direction. Simply put, it is poor marketing. I have to agree with his comments.

The photo itself of course is as cute as intended and I have no complaint with the photographer so please don’t be upset if you are the photographer. It is simply the wrong image for that location.

Secondly and just as important, I note that the AMYA web site now has the Footy population reduced to 14! Who would like to guess how much damage that is doing to the class and potential sales of footys? I believe this situation has been discussed some months ago in the back rooms but nothing has happened so as I was not privvy to the discussion I am bringing the problem into the open in the hope of getting some answers.

I will be making contact with the AMYA myself today to see how this can be changed. Sorry for the negative post but it is intended to provoke a positive response.


Yeah, but what did we have to choose from? Take a look at the Footy web page: The only decent action shots are of a defunct boat (Hang Ten), two illegal boats, or the Bug, with its dry cleaner bag sails. No image problem there!

All the rest are so far away you can just barely see that there are boats, show boats on a stand or a messy workbench (ho-hum), boats in some old timer’s hand (ho-hummer), or boats sitting on a mirror-smooth lake (ho-hummest!) What image would you like to post on the AMYA web page?

Dennis and Graham both have nice shots on their web pages, but post one of them on the AMYA website and listen to the screams of “commercialism!”

Someone want to take a photo of two Footys (that weren’t painted with a #10 broom) beating to windward, overlapped, in a moderate breeze, from a low enough angle with a long enough lens? Bill would post it in an instant!

Fair comment Doug…
I just posted some new photos at these are photos supplied to me by customers so should be viewed as independent and not ‘ScaleSailing’ photos. I can put Bill in contact with the owners if they are of any interest. To avoid commercialism there would be no need to mention what they are, just credit the photographer.

Anyone else have potential photos? to keep this positive…


i have some.
i plan on a footy hull kit with some designs to make them look serious, like today’s ocean racers. there is some pics here of what i’m gonna concoct. production is being held back, cause i’m outta work (need some production supplies)
the link is:
see the open footy thread aswell. the design was never meant to be open from a rules breaking stand point, more of a serious looking craft stand point.
the new shape will conform to the box better.

here’s the hull of the new one.

i also have some pics that might work, anything of the boats sailing… also, don’t we have some people in florida, etc, where the water is still sailable? [not that its frozen here in CT, but we keep up hope… =/]

also, is there some way we could draft up a more “user approved” litte blurb about the footy, and submit it to Bill to replace the current one?

nigel :cool:

I was just wondering… does Swordfish fit the 12-inch rule??? :devil3:

Graham certainly makes a valid point and the site really needs an Injection of Enthusiasim.

Personally any photo of a quality model is OK by me, but there needs to be a lot more available information.

Understand the photo of the Young Girl, it’s been used for quite a while and published in at least one Model Boat magazine. It’s a bit stale and needs a change.

The bigger concern is the 14 registered boats. This doesn’t go well to promote the class. Perhaps a register of owners on the Forum would be worth maintaining.

When researching the class I came across a few plans and I got a good response from Richard Webb (Plan in Model Boats Dec '06). He also has a plan of a Footy style cruising yacht (not the Wonder Footy). If I might quote from his e-mail , “The 12” yacht will be the best one for racing as we race them in England and so far 400 have been built.

His plans for 12" boats can be accessed at

There is a small yacht, the Wonder Footy, a Maid of Styrene 12" and a 13" model of a Thames Barge. With 400 of the small yachts being built there is obviously an interest in this class/size of boat. Not everybody wants to race yachts and some just want to have fun.

What is needed now is to transfer the interest in smaller yachts back into registering of boats for competitive sailing. Design and development is good, but there is a need to get boats on the water quickly and cheaply and expose the class to more people.

Maybe setup a few competitions and exhibitions during breaks at other boat regattas. The footy fits nicely with Model Scale Boats and offers a distraction when sailing in larger classes.

Like a Terrier nipping at the heels of a Great Dane so should the Footy nip at the heels of the IOM & Big Boat classes.

Nigel :cool:

I like your new way of promoting the Footy to the Fairer Sex.

Attaching your new SWORDFISH Bowspit will definately grab their attention. I think the 6.3mm width might be a bit of a disppointment though. With a Bumpkin on the other end it could be frightening :lol:

All said the new Hull looks the business. Keep up the good work…:zbeer:

A few thoughts, guys:

First, I’m more than happy to change the picture. I tried to get some nominations going on the Yahoo forum months ago, but didn’t get much in the way of response. That being the case, I’ll select one and submit it today.

Second, noone is more concerned about those damn population numbers than I am. I have had a number of email conversations about it with a few people to no avail. I have submitted new registrations to Michelle, she gave me the impression they were updated, yet the numbers are still incorrect. As far as I know, I’m doing what is supposed to be done.

When the numbers went down to 14, I again wrote Michelle and John Davis for help. If anyone knows who can fix this, or can help in any way, please contact me! My wife could attest to my level of frustration with this.

The official record is kept by the Class Secretary. By my records we now have 36 AMYA registered skippers. That’s skippers, not boats, which is the number that should be reported on the population page. The problem, of course, is that I know that, but the public information says otherwise. I believe it not only gives a poor impression of the class, but also reflects badly on my credibility. I don’t take that lightly.

Third, if anyone would like to modify the writeup on the Class Page, just do it and send it to me. I will edit, so don’t worry about wordsmithing. Assuming what you submit is in the spirit of the class, I’ll be happy to use it. Just don’t get too carried away. You can see from all the class examples that there is limited space, and the idea is to give a first impression of the class. There’s no room for detailed info, plans, etc. That’s why we started the Footy website. Of course, submissons to that site are always welcome.

Last thought. Though the comment about too much emphasis on kids has been made before, there are currently no kids who have registered Footys in the USA, and there are a lot of registrations from guys who have very low AMYA numbers (they’ve been around a long time) and who have national reputations as designers and racers.

Thanks for your help…Bill H

never mind that swordfish. this is the footy furum. (jokes)
i’m gonna try scrunge up the $ for some sauce (epoxy), so i can make the vessel a reality
the budget: rent, food, utilities, composite supplies.

Thankyou Bill, it is clear from your post that you are doing your best in what seem like less than ideal circumstances. Your post can only raise and confirm your reputation in my eyes so thankyou for explaining.

So, as it seems the AMYA cannot manage the task of keeping it’s numbers up to date at this time can I make a suggestion…

We have the Footy Class page under our control through Charles who does an excellent job. You have the information Bill so why not post class registration numbers there as well as the AMYA. Better yet this will allow us to show IFC (free) registrations too and further swell the numbers.

The list could be split by AMYA regions, AMYA and non AMYA registrations and of course other countries totals. A comprehensive job could be done with the information you already have at least for the USA. If the numbers are simply manually entered on a monthly basis this would be quite a simple process for Charles.


Good idea about posting the population numbers, Graham…I’ll follow up with Charles and get it done.

I did get a bit of info today about the class population numbers from Philip Sarelis, the AMYA webmaster. Here’s what he says:

“Class POP Numbers- As the membership packets are processed, these numbers fluctuate. All the numbers are skewed right now. Many times it is how each member fills it out and verifies the Classes they are registered with. Michelle is not a professional mind reader and only each CS will know the real numbers. If you really want to see bad news, as of the last Database sent to me for web conversion, the membership total is 46. This is inaccurate because there are more than 2500 members currently registered in the different classes according to the Class Pop page. Again these numbers will fluctuate till we get back to 2530. Michelle will send me the correct Class Pop numbers to post rather than using the raw data in the database to post onto the web.”

I take that to mean that all the numbers, not just Footys are suspect, and that it will be resolved eventually by substituting a process involving human judgement rather than digital interpretation. I remain hopeful.

Bill H

p.s. I sent Philip a different photo for the webpage. It should appear shortly.

To follow up, I also had a reply from the magazine editor today in which he said that he is currently working on Issue 147 of Model Yachting magazine. The input he has from the Membership Secretary for the Class Stats & Facts column is that the Footy Class has 35 registered members as of 22 December 2006."

So that is much better news and means that the magazine at least will show a better number. Thankyou for taking up the idea re. class populations on the Footy Class web site Bill. It will be interesting to see how many overall registrations we have (AMYA and non).


I’m glad to hear that, too, since that means Michelle and I are communicating OK. It seems the crux of the problem lies in the intricasies of database processing, and it will be resolved eventually. Meanwhile, though, it’s a royal pain in the aft.


Philip very nicely got right on the changes, and the Footy page no longer has our little girl. So let the critique begin anew! This isn’t cast in stone, so post your pics here if you think you have a better one. It’s probably a good idea to change it now and then anyway. Keep in mind the criteria that Doug pointed out.

I also made some changes to the text. Nothing major, but tweaked it to de-emphasize the cute factor and up the competition factor. I see I made an error that I will correct (missed deleting a word) in my next update. I look forward to your suggestions.

Thanks to all, as usual, for helping make Footys a great class.


It seems that getting Philip involved was the right thing to do! Not only has he updated my changes to the Footy page today, but he seems to have been inspired to investigate further on the numbers problem. Here’s his latest info:

“Oh, on the DB subject. Michelle and I have found out why the issues are what they are. My data may be updated every 2 weeks from her computer but, the core GUI is 2 months old which lends itself to the in accurate results.
You class does have the members you say it does.”

Post your suggestions for the page. I look forward to hearing your ideas. Looks like we have the right things in place now to make progress.


Hello Bill… I can add a little to the numbers progress.

Pete Maxson, the AMYA President phoned me today to discuss the problem, which does indeed seem to be a mix of software issues etc. Without going into details which he may not want public yet, he tells me that the way the numbers find their way on to the website will be radically changed once a new incumbent gets to grips with the software. A change for the better as it sounds like the numbers will be able to be changed daily if we wanted to bother!

Thankyou from Footydom for your efforts today Bill.


I’m pleased that you got that level of response, Graham, I have confidence in Pete. He’s just taking over this year, but he’s demonstrated his dedication to AMYA and the sport in general. I know there are some changes going on…don’t want to step on sensitive parts of my anatomy by saying too much just yet, as they haven’t been officially announced.

What do you think of the changes I’ve made on the page? Don’t pull punches…I want to make it reflect the feelings of the membership.

If you get a chance, maybe you could call me this weekend at 603-284-6642…I’d like to talk to you about regatta possibilities for next season.

And if any of you warm-weather residents would like to hold a Footy regatta this winter, I’d like to hear from you, too!