1:10 Scaled Class

Rcsailing.net Boat Review
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Angus - since you seem to have a love for older designs …

I fell in love for the second time in my life (after the wife) when I saw the cedar strip, clear finished Gougeon boat “GOLDEN DAZY”. It was the first clear coated wooden boat and being able to see and walk up and touch embedded in me my life-long (so far) love of clear finished wood for whatever - furniture, cars (Morgan) guitars, power boats, etc.

A good close multihull friend’s dad had built a scale GOLDEN DAZY in r/c format at about 1 or 1.2 meters in length. He had it displayed on a table in his living room - sans rig, and when I asked about it’s performance, he commented that while it did sail, it was non-competitive since the bulges fostered by old rules (two ton) were not in keeping with then current r/c design.

A wonderful article that provides a lot of background on her history can be found here : http://www.lcyc-vt.org/About_the_Club/Dazy_end_of_an_era.htm

Here are a couple of excerps from the article:

Golden Dazy was built by Gougeon Brothers of Bay City, Michigan. Designed by Ron Holland, she had won Canada’s Cup in 1975. A few years later, when Steele saw her “power by,” her name had been changed to Tern by her new owner.

In 1975, when Golden Dazy raced in the Canada’s Cup, she had the stiffest hull of any of the contenders; at 41’6” it is a combination of strips of Western Red Cedar, okoume plywood, and teak, for a 1 1/8-inch total. Using these woods, Gougeon Brothers pioneered the Wood Epoxy Saturation Technique (W.E.S.T System). When she won, it was said that “the prettiest was the fastest.”

EDIT: Correct link to article!

142

Scale models, or models constructed to a scaled version of the rule, have been successfully built and sailed for the smaller classes of both the International and Universal Rules. The 6 Meter models have been discussed elsewhere. In the 1920s, boats built to the R class limits scaled 1 1/2 in to the foot were an official Model Yacht Racing Association of America class. R boats scale well as small as an inch to the foot. The resulting boats are about 55 inches LOA (in the case of 1 1/2 inch to the foot) and 36 inches LOA in the case of 1 inch to the foot. They will sometimes be referred to as “30-raters” and “20-raters” because that is their rating in inches under the rule.

Cheers,

Earl

143

Earl - if you know - did scaling these “raters” you reference just handle the hull and not rig and keel? If the keel and rig were approved as non-scale, is it posssible to perhaps have you reply with some keel draft and mast height dimensions if you happen have or have access to them?

With the potential for this suggested new 1:10 scaled class, I may have to drive up to Bay City on next visit home and see if I can get one of the guys to “slip me” the lines for DAZY. Should I “score” a set, I will also seek permission to reproducce/share them for r/c builds in case there are otehr wooden boat lovers out there like me. Since DAZY didn’t have a coach house, r/c control and deck gear might be kept to a minimum and still have her “look” good.

Dick

144

They were rated by the full rule, including sail area and displacement (which in the Universal Rule was really a draft limitiation, IIRC).

Here are the dimensions of the 20-rater by Thomas Darling from the 1920s:

LOA: 36" LWL 24" main 43.375 (luff)x47.75(leach)x21.75(foot); jib 27.5 (luff)x23.5(leach)x9.25(foot).

The 30-rater is essentially 1.5x this boat. The 20-rater plans were sold by Stanley Tools and hundreds were made. I’ve redrawn them to eliminate the distortion and can email them to anybody interested (600KB TIFF). Several have been built by our members and they sail very well. Of all the rating rules I’ve studied, I still think the Universal Rule is the most elegant; not surprising, considering its basic principles were established by Nathanael Herreshoff. It may be possible to design an ugly boat to the Universal rule, but you have to work at it :slight_smile:

Cheers,

Earl

145

Dick - I was thinking a generation or two earlier (also optionally available in vanished mahogany): Sunmaid V, Prospect of Whitby I, Roundabout, Firebrand. All of these have the advantage for scaling puroses of the high diisplacements and modest ballast ratios favoured by the Scantling Allowance of the then RORC Rule.

146

Angus -

are lines freely available for any of these? I am waiting fro an answer from Ron Holland to see if I can make DAZY’s line avilable, but would think trying to track down some of these might be difficult? I know Earl and his group of “Vintage Boat” guys have made tremendous effort to get folks access to some of the more prominent US boat designs through some of the maritime museums. Would any of these have availability through a British museum or records perhaps?

One stumbling block is the costs often asscoiated for obtaining a full set of lines - when only shadow stations or offsets are needed. (Although some have no idea how to read off-sets … myself included when it comes to the diagonals).

Since I handle the technical editor volunteer duties for AMYA - any chance you would be willing to pen an article or two with basics of how to interpret hull plans for those who would possibly build, but not have a clue what all the numbers mean? It might prove helpful, and getting just one new builder to the workbench would be agreat payback.

Give some thought. We can correspond off-line. Earl - same question to you as well.

147

All of the S&S lines are available (at a price, but it isn’t totally silly) from S&Sor Mystic. I have dealt with S&S on two setsof ld drawingsandhey arevry helpful indeed. One problem with S&S is that their thoroughness meansthat thee are HUGE numbers of drawings if yiou want to get things really right.

C&N are now a property company company. I am fairly sure that when they ceasedto be Britain’s best yacht yaprd, their archives were passed to the National Maritime Museum in Greenwich - who never throw so much as a toffee paper away.

Holman & Pye still exist. Ten years ago I was involved in repairing a UFO27 (new c. 1978). They could get met he construction drawings down off the shelf during a brief phone call. Hope exists.

It may take a little effort - time passes- but I probably have a line on Ron Holland and Golden Dazy. I used - and moreso my brother - used to havevery strong connections with the Holland/McWilliam/Cudmore mafia in Cork.

Farr wuill sell old drawings, but are expensive.

148

Dick,

I called Meade Gougeon today and he said his brother Joel had a model(half)…called him and he said he gave it to a restaurant which burned down. Meade also said that James Gardiner built six half hulls back then but I could not get his contact number. Perhaps Jim has a set of lines…

The only other place that may still have a half hull(That we know of) is:Charlies Crab house in Detroit.

Unless you can reach James Gardiner,Ron holland may be the best bet.

FYI, Dean

149

Did Meade indicate if they still had any of the original building drawings laying around?

I have an email in to JR Watson, but he hasn’t responded yet. He may have retired by now, and may not know what is left and what is gone.

Thanks for the try - will see if I get any response to the email to Holland. If not, maybe we need to get Angus’ brother to see if he can pull any strings.

I wonder if the r/c model that I originally saw had drawings - or if it was scaled directly from half-hull?

150

Nothing as to availability of plans…Meade did say that Jim’s work was accurate so he may have the plans. I was given a cell number but it is no longer used. Just trying to assist where and if I can…DD

151

Here’s a 1/10 Mini Micro Sportsboat I built recently.

The design itself is of a boat that you sit in rather than on, and is intended to be dis-abled friendly because of this.

The Mini Micro has a LOA of 14foot, Beam of around 5 feet, a 100kg (200lb) bulbed lifting canting keel, and carries Assy Kites.

In a word, they are not designed for the Faint of heart. You drive them like a Racing Car.

Enjoy.

152

For those who prefer the “Lead-free” variety - here is a new one just being launched. At 100 feet - it just makes it inside our self-imposed length limits for the 1:10 class. Sure would be awesome to see this on the water at 1/10 scale !

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Nothing like being Poles apart eh Dick ??

Meaning Biggest V Littlest.:long: :jump:

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What is happening with the Aussie r/c multihull group - if you know? :confused:

I used to correspond with a Peter Birch who was Queensland Secretary as I recall. He dropped out of sight and I have tried a Richard Billet, but still no response. If you know, or have contacts, please pass on our request to be put on mailing list please?

I still like the 1.2 meter boats. Big enough to look great and much better sailing characteristics than even my 1 Meter boat. :wink:

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I’ve sent a couple of letters and Emails to the Australian R/C Authority all to no avail as yet.

I’m sorry but I’m not up to date with the Multi side of things here, however I can say that heading toward the end of this year we in Oz could well have some significant Numbers of 1/10 Scaled boats of varying LOA and Class.

I’ve got an 800mm (Young 780) boat on the go at the moment, with a sucession of similar class boats to build after that. My plan is to have a variety of boats including 700mm (Elliott 7 metre) - 800mm (Stealth/Thompson 8 metre) - 900mm (T30) - 1000mm (T980) - 1200mm (Wildcard) and 1500mm (TBA 15 Metre).

All of which I’ll show Pic’s here in due course.

I dare say that the Mini Micro could well give some of the Footys a run for their money, and whilst it will never be an effective R/C contender, the principle of its design is a pretty cool reflection of what the Real Deal could look like.

With repect to getting the Class established here, I’ll keep plugging away at it, and in time we’ll get there.

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Did you get the lines I sent you last night HCW?

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Yes I did thank you Brett.

Cheers.

158

Any progress? With my TP52 job moving again I am off to designing a 1:10th scale boat that will mirror the new STP 65. Slightly different from the drawings I posted last week, but in the end it will be just under 80" long. Should be moving into a house this winter so if I can get the design complete by then, I can be off to making the plug in my spare time. As much as I love sailing boats (which I am without right now), I find it 10 times more fun once the construction starts and almost disappointing once it has sailed and sailed well and the tinkering stops. Whether the 80" boat will ever sail, it will be crazy fun to build and even more fun to anticipate. Didn’t know if people were busy building their 1/10ers, or if we were all just dreaming, save a few people out there.

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I just want to provide an update for the US readers. I am currently working with the AMYA magazine editor, and was offered some article space in upcoming quarterly publications. Also am trying to put final touches on a recommendation to AMYA for a possible 1/10 SIG group (Special Interest Group) which would allow space - and recognition here in the US.

I am seeking some hi-res photos - with (hopefully) some detail which makes this new class/group so interesting from a scale point of view. If you have some 35mm - or hi-res digital photos of at least 3-6 mpx I would love to hear from you, see the photos, and obtain permissions to have them published.

I am still trying to make contacts with the French to get some good stuff from them, but finding bi-lingual is not too easy. Still, they have a good grasp on the class, and main effort is to find a contact, find out source of supply for some of their deck fittings, and eventually obtain some line drawings for similar boats.

A benefit is that the SIG recognition doesn’t need the usual 20 boat minimum to be recognized, and I can’t find that you must be American either. (Still checking on that one) so very possible the AMYA could host this group until it develops further in other countries. Just a suggestion.

As for my own - I had started cutting shadow-sections last week for a VOR boat. Then attended the F-17 North Americans in Michigan (big beach cats). Came home, but my staff and I are now providing back-up mutual aid to Hennepin County and Minneapolis in light of the recent bridge tragedy there. Not a lot we can do, since the hospitals have their own purchasing staff, and police/fire for city and county are mostly “hours and time”. Big cost will be handled by State of Minnesota (MnDot) transportation office - so we are just kind of being made available just in case. Just as a reminder - DON’T plan on cell phone use in case of major emergency in your area - most lines just couldn’t handle the voice/phone traffic. Too many rely on cell phones. Just a thought I wanted to pass on. Because of this back-up thing, I probably won’t be able to return to boat building until middle of August at earliest.

Dean - I need some photos of your Harken gear if you read this - and also some photos of the TP-52 and other items (or boats) you are working on. If you, Millertime, and HCW can put together a short article on reasons why, what you are building (or hope to build) and some general interest stuff, I can get it included in several issues of the AMYA magazine.

Anyone else building or want to be included - PM or email me please? I’d like to get an idea on what might be able to be put together for publishing.

Thanks all.

Oh yeah - support your local Red Cross. They are doing a heck of a job here! :slight_smile:

160

The Dubois 50 plug and test model made it to Harken’s 40th anniversary party last saturday. First class party! I showed Peter Harken some of the new(not yet put together hardware),he was very impressed.

I am watching all of this and of course willing to help where needed. Was granted permission from Dubois to mass produce the 50. PLease see pictures on the models in progress page under D.

Dick,Very sad…must be something of great pain for you all.Will be thinking of you during this…

Anyone is welcomed to grab pictures of 1/10 projects but the Harken pic’s are protected for now.

All the best to us who have that passion for seeing this become reality. Dean