Movable Ballast?-Psaros 40

Will: Once again you are forcing me to be serious.

I think you have missed the point concerning Doug’s failure to race in any AMYA class.

To date there has been no proof against any recognized standard that Doug’s “ideas” are superior.

He hasn’t raced his multihulls against other multis here or in Europe. His Spinnaker boat is slower than a conventional boat of the same size by his own admission. His Aeroskiff which was promoted for at least two years never appeared. He has not even provided such simple things as his “jib pivot traveller”, his “Hoyt/Lord boom” or one of his wing tip or square top rigs to be proven in any of the various classes in which they are legal or in any races at all. In my mind, at least, it isn’t about AMYA or non-AMYA, its about proving yourself, your skills and your technology in the real world.

As to the issue of “vaporware”, I think the term is being somewhat misused. Certainly, Doug has built boats. No one disputes that fact. What is very much at issue though revolves around “Vapor-performance” claims. For example, without any results to back up his claims he repeatedly asserts that his rig designs are faster than conventional sails. He implies that his F100 will be the fastest boat of its type in the world and he hasn’t even begun construction of a pre-production prototype. He implies that his micromoth could be the fastest r/c boat of its type and to date it has only fallen over itself. He posted a number of years ago and repeated the assertion numerous times that two Swiss Brothers would soon be breaking records and winning races with his multihulls. Only now do we know that not only were these boats not delivered, they were never even built. Frankly, no one else here or anywhere on the web that I am aware makes these kind of claims nor makes them so often.

Finally, let me pose you a question. What kind of technology discussion do you think is valuable?

I for one would like to hear more from Ryan and Dan Sherman. Computational physics is the cutting edge of boat design and they seem to have real training in this field. I like to read what Todd has to say about the various boats he is building and racing. I think JohnB’s pictures of his experimental boat are fascinating. I even find your ideas about a canting rig interesting.

What I don’t want to see are endless threads about the same proprietary technology; performance claims without proof (particularly if they are repeated); and annoucements about developments in full size sailing with little, if any, practical connection to r/c boats on almost a daily basis.

Good job Roy. Well stated.
I do hope that some will really read this for themselves and not read a possible interpretation of it from someone else. What Roy says here is SO true, word for word. If anyone comes away from that post still saying that there are some of us that ?are ?afraid? of new ideas? then there is no hope. If anyone comes away from this saying that ?these guys are not anti- Doug, they are anti- new ideas?, again is just a lost cause. If you think that high tech post are ?not wanted? here, then again??what more can anyone say, it’s just not true.

This forum has totally degenerated in the past month it is barely worth reading at all. It’s just been one never ending string of personal attacks. If you were a beginner in this hobby and came in here lately and read any random topic would you ask for help here? Some moderation is desperately needed in here before this place completely dies.

Lately I’m about one small step from giving up this hobby all together. This place certainly doesn’t help any, that’s for sure.

ryan
dont give up. i know this board has seen alot of name calling. but it is between 4 or 5 people. i for one do not attack anybody. doug ,greg, ray, or dick. you have to understand that this section of the board is called the pub. and as everyone knows , in a pub there are LADIES around and we all like to sound off for them. if you need help ask for it. I needed help with a new class and got some good advice from the people who are fighting here. just step back and watch, you will never get me to give up on the sport of sailing. even if i go out alone. it is still fun. these attack will come to a halt ,soon enough when one side just gives up. and is too tired to contiune.
keep sailing
cougar

a 4
look for the reference
and i will have 2 beers and a basket of bbq wings here
i still think alhingi would have beaten nzl 81
cougar