Kiwi's do it again

Yes, along with the hulu, light displacement offdhore racing boats(Bruce Farr, Paul Whiting and many more) the canting keel on a keeler.
It has been nigging me for some time now as I was not sure about and keeler sailing on the Auckland harbour with a canting keeler. But an article in October’s Seahorse tells of the Jim Young built the “Fiery Cross” in 1958 with a canting keel.
Go the Kiwis

dbl post again?!

Hold it ,John. I think there was an American canting keel boat back in the 40’s; I’ll have to do some research-but for the time being congratualations!
But how did you get the October Seahorse so quick??? Just got the September issue!

Doug Lord
High Technology Sailing/Racing

Not only doing it, we get it first!!!
I am just subscriber.

Gee thanks Dick, but Grunta should be the minister as he has a boat that is sailing.

Another problem I will be doing a timewarp backwards (1 month) as I coming up to the states in October for 3 weeks. But this is where I get confussed, as I will be supervising the riping the heart of your industry. Taking your old technology (a product line) back to NZ.

<blockquote id=“quote”><font size=“1” face=“Verdana, Arial, Helvetica” id=“quote”>quote:<hr height=“1” noshade id=“quote”>[i]…Taking your old technology (a product line) back to NZ.
<hr height=“1” noshade id=“quote”></blockquote id=“quote”></font id=“quote”>

Djeez, you’d better make sure that the customs officers will not take this ‘scrap-yard-material’ into quarantine first when you get back …

Good luck, you daredevil … [:D]

The Aquaholic
No problems I took 18 40 foot containers of plant out of Puerto Rico 4 years ago. Do you want any plant moved, we (kiwi’s) can do it.

Re: The Minister status quo as boats sailing probably qualifly more than a fast mail system. But I cann’t help myself here----“Kiwi’s first again”

[-crzwom] All right, I went out on a limb rooting for you guys earlier this year and look what happened! Not only that but Oracle just got thru whipping Alinghi which means they must have been faster than the broken Kiwi boats…(Nevermind that Gavin Brady sailed and Chris Dickson ran the program)
And furthermore, CBTF was designed in the US and is the world leader in canting keel technology–Go USA!
I still think the HULA is probably a great idea --but not if the basics are wrong…
And I was with you to the bitter end…


hey there race lovers
can anybody tell me what the hula was actauly for? I like the idea of the finger tip boom to cut down on the wieght, but I still cant figure out what the hula was supposed to do. I was hoping for a good series between alinghi and nzl. but wow the kiwis realy screwd up. the boat is fast. but was just not bullet proof. you can say the condition where bad , but alinghi did suffer. and as far as oracle. they had problem early in the series and they didi not get going untill dickson came on board. I personly like cris dickson. i think he is one of the best skipper out there. atleast in the top 3 anyway

Best I can tell the hula was supposed to add unmeasured sailing length…

Doug Lord
High Technology Sailing/Racing

do you know how this was supodes to work? i design my own one meter boats and I am always looking for ideas, stranger the better. i like the radical boats like austII and nzl 32 black majic. if the hula was like a flap on a plane i could see it acting like a lifting suface and that might conteract the dgar that it would incure, how that would affect the balance of the boat. i dont know. but I think i see it on the down wind legs. alinghi never nose dived but there was times that water just poured in and that might be cause by the hula forcing the bow down and lifthing the stern out. or the heavy part out of the water

Cgr- other than a measurement “device” I’m not 100% sure what the hula was. What it COULD have been if it had moved would be a way to change the geometry of the aft sectin of the hull. At least one big ocean racer uses a system that changes the shape of the back end of the boat and anotherone uses trim tabs like a power boat. Lots of room for experimentation depending on your class rule…

Doug Lord
High Technology Sailing/Racing

i dont know what the hula does, if anything but i think you are right in saying that it would change the geometery of the boat. in the class I am trying to design in. I am learning that a narrow beamed boat sails well in heavy conditions. and a wide beamed boat sails well in light winds. why is that? it could be that the amout of the hull in the water allows for less drag. I look at a ts2 and it has almost a 15 inch beam yet it is one of the fastest. why? i think because of the fact it sit on top of the water, not acualy in the water. am i wrong? do you have any suggestion.
thanks in advance

Cougar- you should really consider using your name(pardon me if Cougar IS your name!) It’s more interesting talking with an actual person as opposed to a handle-just a suggestion.
Apparently you are sailing in the IOM class. I know of the TS2’s success but not much about the other boats in the IOM class.
Just guessing but perhaps the performance is related to the fact that the IOM is so heavy 8.8lb.s compared to some US One Meters at around 5 pounds. In the lighter boats it seems that narrow is almost always faster. I’ve read that the TS-2’s performance is good in all conditions but I don’t know much about it…

Doug Lord
High Technology Sailing/Racing

doug cougar is not my real name. it is my nick name that all my friends call me. it is a name that the sailor use when I am in the water. my real name is Lloyd, so if that is okay i will use lloyd here

LLoyd, thanks for introducing yourself BUT please use ANY name that you feel comfortable with! And good luck with learning about design.

Doug Lord
High Technology Sailing/Racing

WRT the Hula: The IACC rule constrains hull shape by “girth measurements” taken at the ends of the LWL. These are made by running a tape measure around the hull and measuring the perimeter (less deck) of the section at that point. This measurement is a basic element of the “International Rule,” which governs 6 and 12 meter boats among other things.

Designers learned that you could beat this rule by fattening the hull immediately inside the measurement points, which is why the later 12 meters have that “potbelly pig” look to them. The fattening gives a longer water run around the hull, thereby giving a longer period to the wave formation and more speed.

The IACC rulemakers attempted to stop this by forbidding concavity (reverse curves) in the hull. The Hula beats this restriction by a) providing a “bump” at the stern and b) not being part of the hull, but being an “attachment.” There is considerable debate as to whether the thing actually added anything to hull speed, since the mandatory gap between it and the hull had to add turbulence. A gimmick, pure and simple, and it will not be missed.

There are several posts by me over on the design section of the forum pertaining to the International Rule and the IMHO superior Universal Rule, which was responsible for those beautiful J Boats.



was it just me or did it seem that without coutts and butterworth , the whole new zealand team fell down. the boat was fast enough to keep up to the swiss but evertime they pushed it it broke. the hula sound like a good idea but I think it was just a grimmick to say they where trying something innovative rather than something revolutionary? i still do not like the finger tip main boom.

Kiwi?s first again ? Moulded sails

This is a quote from the Jan 2004 ?Boating New Zealand? magazine farewelling the Nelson sailmaker Ron Nalder.


?They built what may have been the world?s first mould cut sail. I was allowed under strictest secrecy to watch and help as Ron and Hugh set up what is best described as a system of frames and stringers that resembled a very large model airplane wing, over which Ron built his mould-cut sail? Dickson said. Almost 40 later, all top ocean racing boats have moulded sails.
?The technique has changed but the basic principle is the same as that pioneered by Ron Nalder,? Dickson wrote.

When will these nautical innovations stop coming from down under???

I hope never john. when you think of all the innovative stuff that has come from down under. it is amazing. first austII with the keel and NZL 32 the the fin and bulb. lets forget about 2004, that boat was just a dog. and fell apart when pressed