Unless the tail-end-charlies got a lot better (which is good) the logic of that one escapes me.
In Europe an hour is psychologically much further than it is in the USA,
WHAT the devil does this mean?:devil3:
Americans will drive for several hours to see their best friend. We reckon that 40 minutes is a lot. Belgians reckon that across te next canal (and there are a lot of them in Flanders) is far too far!
Heck -
in some US cities you can’t even get out of the city after driving 45 minutes. For me to drive from Minneapolis south to Texas is a good, solid 21 hours and about 1400 miles (2253 km) and that’s the short way (north to south) with another 4 hours north to Canada from Minneapolis. Going East/West is another, even larger trip.
I have noticed from my daughter’s “Exchange Student” friend’s visits, Europeans just can’t comprehend how large the US really is - and why a large fleet on one coast has problems drawing interest from another area of the country. In fact, if I want to sail in a local club even, it is a 45 minute drive by expressway (70 mph) to get to where the Minneapolis club sails.
No - we all don’t just take a quick weekend drive to Florida to visit Disneyland, and a weekend jaunt to the Rocky Mountains is planned well in advance and usually by air. Unless you live in boardering states, a drive to “another country” - Canada or Mexico is a daylong adventure at shortest.
Just want to put “our distances” in perspective if you haven’t been here. I would love to visit Muzza in Colorado, but drive time of well over 12 hours makes it a bit impractical - especially for a weekend idea. Even a quick trip east to Lake Michigan (Milwaukee Wisconsin) is 5 plus hours.
I think the ability of Europe countries to be so close to other cultures is neat, and travel to another “NATION” in a few hours is unheard of over here.
You definitely pack a lunch when travelling here! 
:lol:
Some of that was what I was trying to say. I have been to the USA and crossed it by train - and back. Yes, it’s BIG. That’s why Americans are relatively immune to distances. Belgians (about the size of Maryland according to the CIA) reckon that 150 miles to go to the seaside FOR A HOLIDAY is a long way! You don’t just pack sandwicjes, you write your weill, tell your relatives …
BUT within 90 minutes drive of Brussels (+/-) you can be in Holland, France, Luxembourg or Germany. Some places like Maastricht, you’re in Holland, Belgium, Holland and Germany are all about 20 minutes away. Hence my interest in things international in this context.
Some of that was what I was trying to say. I have been to the USA and crossed it by train - and back. Yes, it’s BIG. That’s why Americans are relatively immune to distances. Belgians (about the size of Maryland according to the CIA) reckon that 150 miles to go to the seaside FOR A HOLIDAY is a long way! You don’t just pack sandwiches, you write your will, tell your relatives … RICHARDSON’S LAW: The smaller the country the further 10 miles seems!
BUT within 90 minutes drive of Brussels (+/-) you can be in Holland, France, Luxembourg or Germany. Some places like Maastricht you’re in Holland and Belgium, Holland and Germany are all about 20 minutes away. Hence my interest in things international in this context.
As a British expat living in Wisconsin I can vouch for Angus’ phrase ‘In Europe an hour is psychologically much further than it is in the USA.’ From my previous home in Sheffield, England, a two hour drive one way was my absolute self imposed limit! Two hours either north/south on the motorways or east/west on our normal winding roads was a stressful experience indeed. In Wisconsin we jump in the Trailblazer and cruise down the basically empty straight roads for 5… 6 hours without issue. I find it only gets tiring at about 8 to 10 hours. You would have to experience the traffic and physicallity of an 8 hour drive from Sheffield to Torquay on the south coast to appreciate it.
Having said that, I started a ‘club’ here in Sheboygan at the end of 2005 because I did not want to travel an hour to Milwaukee and back twice a week to sail. We have 6 keen members and more interested parties already… so that is a route open to us all. In the UK most decent size towns will have a model boat club… even though those towns are closer together. It is down to us to create these clubs if we wish.
Graham.
‘Sheboygan Area Boat Modellers’
This is my first posting, but I have been following the Footy forums for awhile.
I am still trying to find sources for kits for the Footy. I would like to start with an existing design before diving into one of my own. If anyone in the southeast US wants to get going with a racing group, let me know.
I think I have come up with a solution for maintaining the course size for Footy racing. I have attached a PDF of my proposal.
This is by no means the final solution, but one I think could work. The “marks” could be made from any flotation device as long as the distance from the bottom of the mark to the cross pipe is 18" or whatever would accomodate a floating Footy. They could also be of different colors for ease of understanding the course directions.
The holes need to be drilled in the top of the PVC pipe to equalize bouyancy so the pipes don’t float. I haven’t tried it yet, but it should work. Some of the pieces can be glued together and othered should be “pinned” for easy disassembly and transportation.
I thank you for allowing my input, and I welcome yours.
Calvin
Nice Calvin.
I see two slight probems. How do you make the thing align to the wind? It may well be that what you propose is actually dead right: two leeward ‘drag bodies’ of fairly low aerodynamic profile could be very stable.
Second, because the leeward mark (one end of the line) is offset from the centre of the course, the second and subsequent beats are biased. OK - I know that this is normal on full-size Olympic courses, but the legs are longer so the angles are much smaller. Does it matter? A true beat is a pretty rare thing in real life.
Suggestion. If you make the foam sleeves on the uprights fairly long, and sliding on the uprights, they can be used to adjust depth/flotation.
Get to it and sokve the prblems!
First, in anything other than a zephyr, the windage created by the two downwind marks should keep it aligned. You could also use somewhat larger marks to add to the drag.
I think as far as this course goes, the distance the lee marks are off the true center is minor. we are only talking 5 feet for a 50 foot upwind leg. You can also round the marks from the outside inward.
Calvin
The rule for line length is (total boats +1) * overall length. I would like to see the course capable of taaking 10-15 boats. In terms of the start, this is no geometric problem. Actually, having thought a bit further, I think it’s OK, anti-intuitive though it may seem.
A.
Yes, I am being geometrically naive. Doesn’t matter much.
Welcome Calvin,
Your drawing in the most refined I’ve seen yet. Several discussions on sinking the course centerline have all headed toward the same types of solution. I think we’re on the right track.
I’m in the Southeast. You can view my and other skippers’ locations at http://www.frappr.com/footysailing Add yourself if you like. [/shameless plug] The Footy Class Association page has links to kits and plans. http://footy.rcsailing.net/index.php I know of one other kit, from Dennis Desprois but I don’t have contact info handy, no webpage yet.
See ya on the water sometime.
tallastro
USA33
A draw back of the “sinking string” course design is that you don’t know if the course is out to its 50 feet or not.
Anyone who has laid one of these courses will have noticed that it can be somewhat bananna shaped at times.
The floats between the 2 marks help keep the course straight and show how skewed it is at any time.
Calvins course looks good. Will cost a little to build though,and not the easiest to deploy.We did have this idea right at the beginning of the Internet course discussions though.
Put “sails” on the leeward marks to keep the course pointing downwind.
The 2 leeward marks could be used as a gate,you choose which one you want to round.This eases congestion in big fleets and is common place in fullsize racing these days.
Well it has taken much longer than I would have liked to get started but I can now report some progress at last.
Pictured below are the components of my proposed Mark IV course.
I started work on it today and it looks OK?
The start line is currently four metres long but could be extended if necessary.
Some experimentation will occur as regards flotation requirements.
Hope to get it floating about Thursday of this week.
Just don`t hold your breath cos sometimes life gets in the way. :devil3:
That looks marvellous Ian. A man who does and delivers.
I reckon that at any fleet size for which this course is ever likely to be used a starting line that long should be fine.
A rude question. About how much did it cost? From what I have seen of your posts in the past, you are blessed with a suitable degree of parsimony - so I guess not too much, but it would be nice to know.
“Parsimony”…hmmmm, what an interesting observation.:graduate:
My wife would tell you I am the complete opposite to parsimonious.
But that is another story.:scared:
The cost so far is approximatly NZ$ 35 which is around US$ 20 or UK$ 12 (sorry no pound sign.)
The tubing is 20mm and comes in 4 metre lengths.
Your usual great job, Ian…can’t thank you enough for helping us get this off the ground. I think this course has great potential, and assuming your tests are successful, I’d like to update my article for the AMYA mag with pics of this version.
I won’t hold my breath, but I am anxious to see your float test. If things go well, I’ll be encouraging this as the standard course for Footy regattas in the USA (and everywhere!)
Out of curiosity, what is the tubing and fittings originally made for?
Bill H
Bill, the tubing is PVC tubing used for electrical conduit.:bravo:
It is available in larger diameters but I consididered the 20mm to be the best size for our purposes. :propeller
Did some more work on the course today, so things are running to plan A. :timebomb2
All looking good for the test tomorrow.
Completed construction today.:scared:
Not sure about the attachment of the starboard end of the start line though.
I have it with an ajustable line to the main length line, (see photo ) but I am unsure if it may shorten the course length if it tries to swing too much.
I guess that is one of the suck it and see aspects of this trial.:devil3:
I may have made the whole thing too deep as well.
I was trying to allow clearence for larger model yachts, because as sure as eggs, some other class sailor will try to sail the course and you can just imagine the shambles when his keel gets caught and the whole course goes walkabout.
Clearence is currently 900mm…enough for even a modern marblehead.