Hi sailors,
We NEED to see this site!! http://voiliermaxiwor.free.fr/fonctions.htm It’s amazing, well i’m interested on rc from short time but, i never see it before… A rc model with spinnaker roller [:-bigeyes][:-bigeyes] “Mon dieu”
Aaaallways look on theee briiiight siiiide of liifeeeee
Now “THAT” is a boat worthy of owning ! At least it has what could truly called a spinnaker. Nothing like what we have been lead to believe! [:-hspin]
Interesting and very exciting. Wonder how many batteries are used to run everything.
Anyone know what the cost is for one of these?
Jose - thanks for sharing this.
Doug - you need to go back to your drawing board and revist the normal sizes of spinnaker ratios to main sail ratios. [:-graduate]
Just found this:
—Length: 2.4 meters(94")
—Disp: 25 kg( 55 pounds)
edt: add info, sp
Doug Lord
–High Technology Sailing/Racing
I think this must be a doctored photograph.
This boat violates the principles of how spinnaker systems must be built as set forth in hundreds of posts on this site. The spinnaker is way too large. The jib appears to be doused when the spinnaker is deployed. How can this be???[:-eyebrows]
Wonderful job, maybe a little big and heavy to be used everyday, but it shows what can be done out there…
this jsut goes to show that with the resources and knowledge anything can be done now make it affordable for a college kid with bills to pay[:-bigeyes2]
i love tinkering with these boats it takes up time i’m sure my girfreind is going to hate it soon
Now that you mention it I have built a couple of 36" spinnaker boat prototypes that show the promise of a spinnaker boat kit for under $800 -maybe less.The new 3R class offers the perfect “medium” for an inexpensive kit boat with a working symetrical spin.
Doug Lord
–High Technology Sailing/Racing
I heard rumors to the contrary, that someone wanted to encourage an “open” materials spec - including carbon fiber - and for a beginner’s built boat, no less!
Dick
you are correct. There has been a push for carbon and kevlar in hulls. I belive this a very bad idea. first of all it drives up the cost of the boats. Second becuase a boat cannot be built out of balsa and glass that can compete against a vac baged carbon hull. In my opinion allowing carbon fiber and kevlar in does nothing more than driveout the home builders and allow manufactures to have an edge.
-Dan
Rumors depend on the source; your source was giving you bad info-there will be production 3R kits with spinnakers-and maybe even ready to sail versions. Hopefully, all carbon but not currently allowed.
Doug Lord
–High Technology Sailing/Racing
Well - there might be “SOME” homebuilders that can function with carbon or Kevlar, but once a new person sees the price of carbon per yard - they won’t go any further. Even to find out how much yardage would be required. Of course, then there is needed experience with vacuum bag techniques, and the mere mention of the word “composites” will drop out another bunch.
Was kind of watching how it all shakes out - as had given a liitle thought (not a lot) to the class idea.
Hopefully you can keep it on a balsa and glass construction. Let the manufacturers and custom builders find a class elsewhere in which to mess up with ideas and technology.
Not sure why Doug would want spinnakers here when he has already posted they can be used in another class. Hopefully he will allow this class to grow without need for turning it too into a spinnaker/canting keel/foiler topic.
EDIT: Spelling
Why play with a class that has as it’s source a level playing field for all and not just those with the money. Before any changes should be made to construction materials the powers at be need to take a feather out of the america’s cup and first determine whether the existing boats will be immediately out classed.
Peter
<blockquote id=“quote”><font size=“1” face=“Verdana, Arial, Helvetica” id=“quote”>quote:<hr height=“1” noshade id=“quote”>Originally posted by Dick Lemke
encourage an “open” materials spec - including carbon fiber <hr height=“1” noshade id=“quote”></blockquote id=“quote”></font id=“quote”>
<blockquote id=“quote”><font size=“1” face=“Verdana, Arial, Helvetica” id=“quote”>quote:<hr height=“1” noshade id=“quote”>by Doug Lord:
Hopefully, all carbon <hr height=“1” noshade id=“quote”></blockquote id=“quote”></font id=“quote”>
Gee - sounds like the rumor is correct after all - eh ? My source giving me bad rumors? Not likely… Must be you doing the carbon promotion as well as the spinnakers.
Ummmm- thought at one time you also said spinnakers on boats under 1 Meter weren’t practical - the hull was too small for all the gear, extra winches, sail storage tube, etc. etc. etc. ? _ or was that a figment of my imagination too?
The 3R class was originally conceived of as an open development class; spinnakers were voted in and carbon out-for now. The rules, unfortunately, are not locked in so if the spinnaker works well in competition it will probably be voted out(?) but that won’t stop a one design spinnaker version should that happen.
The beauty of this class is that it will be MUCH less expensive that an IOM or 36/600 with a smmaller rig and smaller keel. Even with a spinnaker system it will cost less than a tricked out 36/600 and much less than an IOM.
I realize that virtually nobody that uses this forum except me , David Goebel and Rich Matt have any experience sailing an RC monohull with a spinnaker but it adds a lot to racing and is a great deal of fun just to fool around with. So I think the 3R concept has merit and shows great foresight in allowing rc spinnakers-not only are they fun to race with but they add a touch of beauty to any race course that is hard to match…
Doug Lord
–High Technology Sailing/Racing
Just wondering …
what happened to the word/concept “Beginner” - seems it got lost somewhere between spinnaker and carbon. GO look for it - QUICK!
What you describe seems to reflect the Spinnaker 50 boat - you know, the one that has a spinnaker and is a “One Design*sorta”?
I suppose if you build to a class size, and thing weighs more than two boats of another class, and it can’t get out of it’s own way, … why then heck … just call it a “One Design” and you have an excuse why it isn’t competitive at it’s designed waterline.
EDIT: added important information and viewpoint.
Yet again if Doug can’t get his spinnaker idea off the ground, he wants to start another class just so he can have it.
Adding a spinnaker requires extra winch(es) and more expensive radio gear which everybody can’t afford. Yet again Doug is alienating all but those with money. Spinnakers can’t be fitted to existing boats so that then means more money for another boat.
Doug just leave the things alone and let those that enjoy sailing that design sail it the way it is.
Peter
I’m notsure this class was ever conceived of for beginners-keeping costs under control has been a major point.
I don’t think an open development class where you have to design and build your own boat (currently) is suitable for either the begining sailor or begining builder.
However, when there are 3R kits available or even ready to sail boats then it will be a perfect beginners boat …
Doug Lord
–High Technology Sailing/Racing
for those that are interested here are the class rules
1.0 GENERAL
1.1 The Three Rater (3R) class is a development class.
1.2 Anything not specifically restricted or prohibited is PERMITTED.
2.0 FORMULA
Formula: 3 = LWL x SA / 7000
2.1 Measurements
2.1.1 Maximum draft is 12 inches.
2.1.2 All measurements shall be taken in inches, and decimals thereof, rounded to
the nearest tenths of an inch.
2.1.3 All floating measurements shall be taken in fresh water.
2.1.4 Yachts shall be measured in racing trim. However a small weight equal to
the weight of rig and sails may replace the rig and sails. The weight would
be placed on deck at the mast step.
2.1.5 Yachts shall have the water line marked on the hull, such that the marks are
clearly visible. Forward and aft waterline marks are permissible, and if used
must be a minimum of one inch in length and one eight inch in width.
Measured waterline may be below designated waterline marks but not
above.
2.1.6 Sails shall be measured in accordance with the 10-Rater method of
measurement. Spinnakers shall not be included in sail area measurement.
3.0 HULL
3.1 Hull shall be a monohull configuration.
3.2 Bow Bumpers are mandatory for all 3R class yachts. Bow bumpers must be of resilient
fabrication to minimize damage to another yacht in the event of a collision.
4.0 APPENDAGES
4.1 Keel(s) may be removable, but shall be fixed while racing.
5.0 RADIO EQUIPMENT
5.1 Maximum number of functions shall be limited to four (4).
6.0 PROHIBITED
6.1 Moveable ballast.
6.2 Canting keel(s).
6.3 Canting mast. Adjustment or movement of the mast in the port/starboard direction by
other than manual means is prohibited.
6.4 Use of any material exceeding the density of pure lead (0.41 lbs./in3).
6.5 The use of high-tech or exotic materials, such as carbon fiber or Kevlar, in hull
construction.
7.0 DESIGNATIONS
7.1 The class logo shall be a stylized 3R.
7.2 Sail designations (class logo and registration numbers) shall be placed in the upper third
and on both sides of the mainsail. The class logo shall be at least 1 inch high.
Registration numbers shall be at least 2 inches high.
8.0 CERTIFICATION
8.1 Certification of a 3R Class yacht confirms that the yacht conforms to the 3R Class
Rules.
8.2 The Class Secretary shall maintain records of 3R Class yacht certifications.
8.3 Prior to competing in a sanctioned regatta each 3R class yacht must obtain a 3R Class
certificate.
8.4 An official measurer designated by the 3R Class secretary shall measure the yacht and
record the measurements on the Official 3R Class Measurement Form. An official
measurer may measure his/her own 3R Class yacht for initial certification. A 3R yacht
measured by its owner for initial certification must be verified by at least two other 3R
Class registered members prior to competing in a sanctioned regatta.
8.5 The official measurement form will be sent to the 3R Class Secretary along with any
3R Class certification fees.
8.6 The 3R Class Secretary will assign a certification number that will be affixed to the hull
in a visually accessible location.
8.7 The certification number will be used as the registration number and sail numbers.
8.8 After initial certification a 3R Class yacht must be measured prior to each sanctioned
regatta to verify that its measurements still match the measurements on its certification
form.
8.9 A 3R Yacht must be re-certified whenever a modification to the yacht alters any item
on the measurement form.
and a link to the 3R forum
http://www.ayerpuzzles.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.cgi
-Dan
For all those interested here are the first ideas ever posted on the 3R forum, by the man that conceived the class.
?I would like to propose a new RC development class for those who would like to design and build from scratch small, racing sailboats to a class rule that would emerge from email discussion with enough popularity to be accepted by the AMYA.?
-Dan
Once again, it takes only a few days for a topic to turn into a debate about Doug Lord and his latest “products”.
This really needs to end! Doug Lord and Microsail are not a part of the mainstream of r/c sailing. No races for his boats; no classes for his products, no history of success in r/c racing and only a handful of total boats sold. Yet just about every topic here gets hijacked into a contentious discussion of one or another of Doug’s “breakthroughs”–foils, moving ballast, moving keels, reefing rigs.
Moderators, its time you figured out some way to stop this. Please!!!
topic locked by moderator
Dansherman